MICHEL MARTIN, BYLINE: By the time Marvin Sapp was 10 years old, he was singing all the time. He sang in church. He sang R&B with his buddies. But then his mother told him he had to make a choice.
MARVIN SAPP: And she said to me - she said, you can sing in the church or in the world. You can't do both. And I chose to sing gospel music.
MARTIN: It was a good choice. For decades, Marvin Sapp has been one of the most admired and successful gospel singers in the country.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "NEVER WOULD HAVE MADE IT")
SAPP: (Singing) And I never, never would have made it. Oh, I never could have made it...
MARTIN: So it raised more than a few eyebrows when, a few weeks ago, he released an R&B album.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "LISTEN")
SAPP: (Singing) Why would it make sense not to listen to your heart?
MARTIN: This is one of the songs on the new Marvin Sapp album, "If I Were An R&B Singer." So that made me think of what his mom told him all those years ago.
Why can't you sing gospel and secular music at the same time? I mean, I'm thinking Aretha Franklin. I mean...
SAPP: Well, I mean, you know, I probably could have. But I guess my mentality and my mindset has always been, honestly, that when you do music, you have to have a specific conviction that goes along with it. And if you don't have that conviction, you can't convey it properly.
MARTIN: Also, you were 10 (laughter).
SAPP: I was 10, yeah. Yeah, I was 10.
MARTIN: Kind of hard to go against...
SAPP: It was. Ten - it's kind of hard to go against Mom at 10 years old, yeah.
MARTIN: Kind of hard to go against Mom at 10.
SAPP: You know, I never thought about that. You know, but the fact that she gave me the option.
MARTIN: So one of the reasons we're talking to you now is that you actually, on Valentine's Day...
SAPP: Yeah.
MARTIN: ...Delivered what for a lot of people was a surprise.
SAPP: Yeah, it was a shock.
MARTIN: It's an - it is an R&B EP.
SAPP: Yeah.
MARTIN: So why are you going against Mom's wishes now?
SAPP: Well, you know, I don't know if I'm necessarily going against Mom's wishes. I think for years, people have always asked me, you know, why I haven't sang R&B. And I would just tell them - I say, that's not really my passion. And after being asked for so many years, I finally just said - after sitting down honestly with my son and with one of his good friends, who actually produced it, Kolten, I actually said, you know what? People been asking me forever and a day, you know, what would I actually sound like singing R&B? So I decided to give them what they've been asking for.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "FREE FALLIN")
SAPP: (Singing) Whenever you need someone you can count on me 'cause you've been by my side every time I need you. Never falling off when we disagree 'cause iron sharpens iron. Baby, sharpen me up.
MARTIN: First of all, I was curious about which song came to you first.
SAPP: Oh, that's easy.
MARTIN: Which one?
SAPP: "Free Fallin," because my son and Kolten wrote it together. And when they presented it to me, I was like, oh. Oh, wow, this is deep.
MARTIN: There are strains of sadness in that song.
SAPP: Yeah.
MARTIN: And we can talk about what you bring to it if you don't mind.
SAPP: Well, you know, I think - I was married for 18 years. And...
MARTIN: You lost your wife.
SAPP: My wife went home to be with the Lord. She transitioned from this life to life eternal some 14, almost 15 years ago.
MARTIN: Yeah, in 2010...
SAPP: Yeah, and...
MARTIN: ...From cancer, as I understand.
SAPP: Yeah, from cancer - colon cancer.
MARTIN: I'm so sorry for your loss...
SAPP: Yeah.
MARTIN: ...If I may.
SAPP: Thank you. And I met her in the third grade, and we went to elementary school, middle school, high school. And when she transitioned, I was like, wow, you know, what I'm going to do? Because I got three kids. They were all preteen and teenagers. And I really dedicated and focused my life to raising them. And listening to that song, when I first heard it and even began to help them write it, I literally began to reflect on what happened for me and how it was when their mother and I were together.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "FREE FALLIN")
SAPP: (Singing) You show me what love is. Girl, I'm invested. Might miss my blessing if I don't let go. Baby, if we fall, I'm free falling. Baby, if I fall, I'd rather fall...
MARTIN: You know, one of the songs for which your most famous - a gospel song again - is "Here I Am."
SAPP: Oh, yeah.
MARTIN: It's a three-tissue one for me.
SAPP: It's a three tissue - OK.
MARTIN: It's a three-tissue one for me.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "HERE I AM")
SAPP: (Singing) There were times when I almost gave up, and I've cried and said, Lord, it's too much.
MARTIN: And I thought, mistakenly, that you wrote that after you lost your wife.
SAPP: No.
MARTIN: But you didn't. You wrote it before.
SAPP: Yeah.
MARTIN: You released it almost a year before.
SAPP: Yeah.
MARTIN: And I was just wondering, what gave you that insight into grief?
SAPP: Well, you know, when the song - myself and Jonathan Dunn, who is, you know, actually the chief writer of that song - when he presented it to me, and we listened to it and really kind of reworked it, lyrically, it was just amazing. Honestly, this was MaLinda's favorite song. A year before even she passed away, she would listen to it all the time, you know, because she was going through chemo and going through the whole process of fighting for her life.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "HERE I AM")
SAPP: (Singing) But here I am. I'm still standing. Here I am, after all I've been through. I survived...
You know, going through cancer - it's one thing for you to go through it as an individual. It's another thing for you to have a mate who is helpless and can't do anything but be there. You know, when you're a man, your purpose as a husband is to be the protector, the provider, that individual who's supposed to fix it. And when you can't fix it, you feel inadequate. But she would play that song, "Here I Am." I'm still standing. And I was like, wow, you know, the fact that you're going through what you're going through, and you're able to declare and decree that you're not going to allow what's happening to you to destroy you, but you're going to stand in it - I thought that was powerful.
MARTIN: Why are you trying to break me so early in the morning?
SAPP: (Laughter).
MARTIN: I'm, like - I'm barely holding on here.
SAPP: I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
MARTIN: I'm barely holding on here (laughter).
SAPP: I'm sorry. You brought the preacher here. That's the problem. You brought the preacher in the building.
MARTIN: I guess I did.
SAPP: Yeah.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "MOMENT OR LIFETIME")
SAPP: (Singing) 'Cause it's high what we're feeling inside. But the question is - is this for a moment or a lifetime?
MARTIN: You sort of suggested that this R&B album is the one-and-done, right?
SAPP: Oh, yeah. I didn't suggest it.
MARTIN: But why?
SAPP: That's it.
MARTIN: You said - why?
SAPP: Oh, no.
MARTIN: Why?
SAPP: You know, because it was...
MARTIN: Why?
SAPP: I took the risk, and I put out something that I kind of felt like - it was, like, a bucket-list thing. It was kind of like, it ain't that I can't do it. I could do it. But this is not my calling. So it's just a great blessing for me to be able to try something different. I thought I had something to say, so I said it.
MARTIN: Bishop Marvin Sapp - his new album is called "If I Were An R&B Singer." Bishop Sapp, thank you so much for stopping by.
SAPP: Thank you. I appreciate it.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "MOMENT OR LIFETIME")
SAPP: (Singing) I rather take my time than take it easy.
MARTIN: Marvin Sapp dropped by NPR's offices to record a Tiny Desk concert. That should be out in the world by the end of the week. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR鈥檚 programming is the audio record.
