STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
Let's learn something now about Canada's next leader. Mark Carney has not held an elected office, but he knows something about government and finance. He once led Canada's central bank and managed it well enough that he was hired to run the central bank of a different country - the Bank of England. Now Canada's Liberal Party has elected him as its head, which means he soon becomes prime minister. Colin Robertson is a former Canadian diplomat, a fellow at the Canadian Global Affairs Institute, which is a nonpartisan think tank, and he's on the line. Good morning, sir.
COLIN ROBERTSON: Good to be with you, Steve.
INSKEEP: What does Mark Carney bring to the table as a leader?
ROBERTSON: Well, he's smart. He's confident. He has a real sense of public service. I met him in the '90s when he'd first come to Ottawa to work at our finance department. He'd been at Goldman Sachs. And one of my friends in Toronto said, get to know this guy - he's a comer. And I was impressed by him. He's written a big book, which is a bit of a slog. It's like a Ph.D. thesis. But he cares about climate, the economy. Safe hands. He wouldn't be accused of being particularly charismatic, but he wants to put the emphasis on growth, which is what Canada needs today if we're going to pay for all the things that you need, like public services and defense.
INSKEEP: You mentioned Goldman Sachs, the American financial firm. Sounds like he knows the United States pretty well.
ROBERTSON: Yes, I think he does. He went to Harvard, and he went to Oxford. In his career as a central banker both for Canada and Britain, he would get to know all the Americans. So, yes, he'll have a big network. I think he met Trump when Trump was president the first time at a G20 meeting.
INSKEEP: Now, he has a problem with President Trump immediately because the president has repeatedly referred to Canada as the 51st state, has imposed tariffs, also taken off some tariffs or delayed some tariffs. We're in the middle of an extremely confusing trade war. Do you feel you understand what his approach will be?
ROBERTSON: Well, I think all Canadians have a problem with Mr. Trump, and he just reflects where Canadians are coming from. Will he have a challenge with Mr. Trump? Probably. But he'll listen to Mr. Trump and make the case for Canada and why this makes no sense. And I hope Mr. Trump pays attention because it doesn't make any sense. We have this - we make things together. We have this mutually beneficial relationship that goes back decades, goes back to before the Second World War with Franklin Roosevelt and our then-Prime Minister Mackenzie King put in place this framework for access to the United States. In return, we'd watch your back on the north.
INSKEEP: Well, I'm thinking that through. There are so many ways that Canadians are connected with Americans through history. Canadian troops as well as American troops went ashore on D-Day. Canadians helped to rescue Americans from Tehran during the Iranian revolution. I could go on and on.
ROBERTSON: 9/11, exactly. There's all sorts of things.
INSKEEP: And Canadians have structured their economy to be closely integrated with the United States. Are Canadians now saying this was a mistake, we need to figure things out a different way?
ROBERTSON: Or certainly looking at all the options, yes. I think there's a sense that if you can't rely on what has been your friend, your neighbor and principal partner, you've got to look to other means of trade diversification. But we're also dealing with what we call the unfinished business of Confederation. Since 1867, we've had a lot of trade barriers between our 13 provinces and territories, and now that's being taken on in a big way because that'll help the economy. The preference would be to maintain that secure access to the United States. That's the first option. So we've been mounting a major campaign over the last year, even before the election, to just remind Americans how much we depend on each other. Thirty-seven American states, their biggest export market is Canada. So this really does make no sense what Mr. Trump is doing.
INSKEEP: Are you trapped? And by this I mean you've structured things in a way that you don't have any choice but to deal with the U.S. For example, the oil pipelines run from Canada down to the United States. Do you not have any choice?
ROBERTSON: Well, to a large degree, geography is destiny. And you can't change our geography. That's correct - again, why this doesn't make a lot of sense. But we are looking now to other options. Our former prime minister, Jean Chretien, who's 91, yesterday at the convention said, look, we should build a pipeline to the east coast so we can start providing energy to Europe that wants it. So I think all options are on the table now.
INSKEEP: Just got a few seconds...
ROBERTSON: And there's broad unity between our premiers, who are of other parties, and the prime minister. And that's really important as well. Like the United States, we're a federation.
INSKEEP: Just got a few seconds, Mr. Robertson. But I want to note you are not in Canada right now. You're in Sarasota, Florida. What are you hearing from Americans?
ROBERTSON: Well, I'm struck by my neighbors who are coming up to me, because they know I'm Canadian, and almost apologetic, saying this isn't what they voted for. Most of them voted for Trump. I'm living in a district that voted heavily for Trump. And they think this is a bad idea, and as I say, they're apologetic. And it is a bad idea. And I say, well, phone your congressman. Tell them this is a bad idea. It's not working for you. Remember, Canadians spend 50 million - used to spend 50 million nights a year in Florida. So that's also a hit if we don't come down to Florida.
INSKEEP: Colin Robertson is vice president at the Canadian Global Affairs Institute. Thanks so much.
ROBERTSON: Thanks, Steve. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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